Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty?

There's little doubt that this is looking like a Democratic year. Obama has a number of impressive things going for him:

1) Advantage in Democratic registration. Rasmussen currently has it at 41.4 D, 31.7 R, 26.9 I...the largest gap since they began tracking party I.D. six years ago. [Nov. 04: 38.8D, 37.1 R, 24.1 I; Nov. 06 37.5 D, 31.4 R, 31.2 D. ]

2) The right track/wrong track number is 17/79. [Rasmussen]

3) Bush's approval rating is at a new low, 31 percent. [Rasmussen]

More beneath the fold.  Cross-posted from:  http://outsidetheechosphere.wordpress.co m/

4) The contrast between Obama's energy & youth vs. McCain's doddering & age is spectacular.

5) Obama's staggering fundraising, along with Democratic fundraising in general, is killing McCain's.

6) For all that the liberal/Left blogosphere is consumed by the question of Hillary supporters voting for Obama, there is a lot of lack of enthusiasm for McCain in many parts of the Republican party. Note: I'll wager right now that evangelical vote for McCain is significantly lower than for Bush.

7) Democratic control of Congress will let Democrats set the agenda for votes that are ugly for McCain.

8.) Bob Barr on the Libertarian ticket is probably going to siphon off some of the Club for Growth economic voters away from McCain in protest. I figure 2-3 percent by election day. In contrast, while Nader is on the ballot, I have a hard time constructing a picture of a Democratic voter who won't vote for Obama but would vote for Nader.

9) McCain has proven to be a lousy debater.

10) Obama is going to have a far more robust field organization than any Democrat in history.

11) The GOP brand is badly damaged. People want change and it's difficult for McCain to position himself as a advocate for change, especially since his voting record for the past two sessions of Congress are 100 support for Bush one year, 95 percent the other.

12) Due to a combination of several of the preceding factors, the GOP campaign to date has ranged from tepid to desultory.

13) Hillary didn't make enough of an inroad with her "experience & security" arguments through the Democratic primaries; it's an open question as to whether McCain will have any better luck with the same pitch in the general.

In aggregate, all that suggests an Obama landslide in November.
However, there are some cautionary signs for Obama.

1) John McCain has a reputation as a maverick, a moderate, and a straight talker. All three propositions are demonstrably false. Yet all three propositions are deeply embedded in the public narrative about John McCain. If McCain manages to sustain that narrative, his appeal to moderate swing voters will be significant. Elections are often won and lost in the middle.

2) The last Democratic candidate whose base was youth, college-educated voters, and black voters was: George McGovern.

3) The last Democratic candidate who campaigned as an outsider and promised to transform Washington was: Jimmy Carter, who only narrowly edged Jerry Ford in the post-Watergate election.

4) I don't know what's more impressive, the fact that Obama could outspend Hillary 3-1 in Pennysylvania or that, with the spending and the momentum, he could still lose by 10 points. This suggests that having a financial advantage may not be sufficient in a close election, that there's a certain inelastic quality to his support, a threshhold that may be difficult to push past in several key states.

5) Polling continues to indicate softness for Obama support among both white men (20 point lead McCain) and white working class women. [Note: While I don't know that it would be the best thing for Hillary or the best thing for the country, she adds a quality as VP that no other candidate does. All the others are political pygmies in comparison. ]

6) McCain leads Obama on polling on national security issues 49-41, as a better leader 43-38, and is essentially tied with Obama on values 43-42. The broad outline of McCain's campaign is clear: in one sentence, it will boil down to, "You may not like me on all the issues but you can't trust him." Fear, uncertainty, and doubt are going to be the staples of the GOP campaign and their 527 allies.

7) The state-by-state electoral map isn't as comforting as the general picture. My own analysis, based on current polls but tweaked by experience & gut feel is:

Bush to Obama states:

Virginia (13) Northern Virginia D.C. suburban vote & black voter turnout carries the day for Obama; Warner winning in a landslide helps.

Colorado (9) Obama has consistently polled well here and the bluing continues

Iowa (7) Obama's primary field organization pays off

New Mexico (5) Obama locks up state that was narrow Kerry loss.

Kerry to McCain:

New Hampshire (4) Obama lost in New Hampshire, McCain won. McCain has a strong appeal to independents. May be a lot of ticket splitting as Shaheen handily beats Sununu in the Senate race.

Michigan (17) Today's poll notwithstanding, tough sledding for Obama. He took his name off the primary ballot for a very good reason: he wasn't going to do well vs. Hillary. Michigan goes against the grain in that the state is fairly soured on Gov. Granholm and here the Democratic brand is damaged goods.

Republican toss-ups held:

Florida (27) Hillary had a good chance; with Obama, it's out of reach.

Ohio (20) A bluing state but Obama got whipped by Clinton. Hillary would have taken it. It's going to be a contest between elevated black turnout in Cleveland and white working class defections across the state. Right now, I think it winds up going for McCain. Ohio is the most conservative of the Rust Belt states, the victories of Strickland et al notwithstanding.

Nevada (5) Not as liberal as New Mexico. I think McCain plays better here than many other places and polling currently bears that out.

Democratic held toss-ups:

Pennsylvania (21) Damn, I can't tell you how annoyed I am that Democrats are going to have to expend resources to keep this in the Democratic column. We should prevail but this one shouldn't even be on the boards.

Wisconsin (10) A swing state, I think Obama will do better here than Kerry did.

Minnesota (10) See Wisconsin.

Notes on some others: I think there's some serious use of recreational pharmaceuticals by folks who think Obama can take North Carolina or Mississippi. What Obama and elevated black turnout will do is turn a lot of 20 point losses from previous years into 10 point losses this year.

So there's my take. A lot of issues raised: philosophical, demographic, strategic, tactical. Have at it.

-Inigo Montoya



Display:


Disagree on Michigan (2.00 / 1)

I lived there last year. Like New Jersey, Michigan always flirts with the GOP. And then the Democrats win big on Election Day. The key for Michigan is black voters. If they stay home, the GOP wins. If they come out, the Dems win.

Michigan has actually gotten demographically blacker the last few years as white working class voters from places like Livonia and Warren have moved out of the state (many to here in Tennessee). As a result, Obama will end up winning easily in Michigan.

Also, remember that McCain got beaten by Romney in Michigan, largely because he told the state's workers their jobs would never come back. This is not 2000. Michiganders are not looking for a maverick Republican. They're looking for a job creator. And they blame Bush Republicanism for their ills.

As for NH, similar story applies. Obama basically tied Clinton there. And the state has trended bluer. It will be close, but with only 4 EVs, it doesn't do much.

In OH, the key will be the Appalachian voters in SE Ohio. We know they preferred Clinton over Obama. But polls of OH show most SE Ohio voters dislike BOTH candidates (same was true in WV). If Obama can work with Ted Strickland in SE Ohio, he can win there. And with that he takes the state.

Florida is also more possible than people think, but I'll wait for another poll to show it. Latinos nationwide are more pro-Obama than they were pro-Kerry or pro-Gore. And FL Latinos are more Democratic than in the past. As for elderly Jewish voters, my Jewish grandmother in Palm Beach County guesses nearly all her friends and neighbors will go with Obama - and they all supported Clinton.

The military vote will help McCain in FL, as will Charlie Crist.  But FL will be close.


by elrod on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 09:46:43 PM EST

Re: Disagree on Michigan (none / 0)

Um Kerry and Gore didn't win big in Michigan.  It will be a close Obama win... I'll say 2-4%


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:22:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

So you think your gut feeling is better then poblanos analysis? Show us your record.


"In the primary you should vote with your heart, but in the general, you should vote with your head" Hillary's husband
by venician on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 09:46:57 PM EST

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

I missed two states in 2000:  New Mexico...and Florida.

In 2004 I said that it would hinge on Ohio and that it would be very close.

In December of 1991, I said that Bill Clinton would beat Bush the following November.  I admit, the whole Gennifer Flowers thing gave me heartburn and nearly derailed the scenario.  

Are you old enough to go back before then?


by InigoMontoya on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 09:55:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

I'll take math (and a provable reccord) over what is possibly blind luck any day.


-7.33, -3.35 The song that best describes life
by drache on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:02:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

Yes, I understand:  something at a variance with the group think of the echosphere is resisted.


by InigoMontoya on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:04:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

rotfl

Variance eh?

Sense you want to use big words then you should understand that statistical analysis is surperior to just throwing senarios out there and that people have come up with some very realistic senarios that you apparently don't like.

And not liking them you retreat to the easiest form of defense: denial of reality.

Then you sprinkle in some projecting apparently.

Tell you what come up with some evidence backing this wild speculation or I'm just going to think you're a troll and go away.


-7.33, -3.35 The song that best describes life
by drache on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:13:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

My academic background is Political Science (Survey Research & Elections) and I was on paid staff on two presidential campaigns.  

And, fwiw, fivethirtyeight.com is one of exactly two websites I link to from my own blog; I'm familiar with Poblano in particular and with modeling in general.  And, fwiw, I don't indulge in wild speculation unless asked to do so and it's labeled as such.

I knew when I posted here that some True Believers would reject the post because it's not as gaudily positive as some are projecting.  

Shrug.  It's a free country, Slick.  If you don't like it, stay happily within the echosphere.
 


by InigoMontoya on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:20:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

And I work on statistical anaylsis in Solid State and Quantum Physics.

So now that we've flashed each other can we move on?

This IS wild speculation, or at the very least speculation as you provide no proof or evidence just some concern.

I just love how you keep up the ad homemiens and while I honestly just think it shows how weak your agruement is the fact is that I'm a late comer on this. I didn't even vote in the primairy due to screw ups with registering and if I had I wouldn't have voted for Obama.

But please keep acting like a troll because like I said all it shows is your immature and your agruement is weak


-7.33, -3.35 The song that best describes life
by drache on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:26:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

Old enough to always ask for proof and never rely on someone elses gut feeling.


"In the primary you should vote with your heart, but in the general, you should vote with your head" Hillary's husband
by venician on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:07:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

Political analysis is as much art as science.   Look at the stupid marketing decisions made by numbers alone.


by InigoMontoya on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:13:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

and yet you completely overlook the statistical aspect of it.

You have a small point in that the statistics may be a little fuzzy but that doesn't change that there are hard numbers of support, money polls and so on.

And you're ignoring all of that and doing some hand waving


-7.33, -3.35 The song that best describes life
by drache on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:20:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

Slick, this ain't a peer-reviewed journal.   Moreover, this post will be in the archives, just waiting for phosphors to be activated and bring it back to life again if someone is really motivated to say "I told you so!" in five months.

And, yes, I track polls, money, and take that all into account.

But thanks for explaining about the solid state physics and stuff.   I worked in the aerospace environment for a number of years and am familiar with the type that thinks everything can be quantified and that confuse "subjective" with "invalid."  In physics, it certainly would be; politics is not akin to physics, except that certain analogs, even to things like moments of inertia, do apply.


by InigoMontoya on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:37:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

Since you seem to need me to hold your hand and walk you though this I will.

You implied (and stated) that I had no clue what I was talking about. As I pratically eat, sleep and breathe statistics I wanted to show just how wrong you are but you seem to have missed that.

Now in 5 months you're welcome to tell me I told you so if Obama doesn't win NC or come close; unlike you (judging from how you've responded to my critcisms by ignoring them for fallacies) I don't have an overwhelming need to always be right.

Now having called me a follower, implied I have no free thought; you've now implied elitism/arrogance. Tell me do you have any more insults and ad homeinems? Because if so perhaps you should just list them now and get them out of the way


-7.33, -3.35 The song that best describes life
by drache on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 11:57:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

Sweetie, the fact that you eat/sleep/breathe statistics is no testament of your abilities for political analysis. An appreciation of statistics is necessary but not sufficient.

When it's 11pm of a 15-hour campaign day and you're on the seventh Pepsi of the day while looking at some new numbers and having to make an on-the-spot judgment as to whether a small change in numbers is noise or the beginning of a trend and you need to decide in 30 minutes whether to push a message or ease off, whether to send advance to city X instead of city Y, whether to divert ad money from one market to another, it's a lot closer to examining the entrails of a possum scraped off the road than it is conducting formal statistical tests.   Call it hand waving if you prefer.  If you're either good or lucky, you get it right more often than not, distilling a lot of snippets of information into a picture which is plausible and which you hope to God is right.

You remind of some doctors or lawyers, who because they're very very smart to have gotten where they are, assume their knowledge transfers to every field.  Often, the engineers and MBA's are easier to work with because they have a better innate sense of their limitations.

I don't particularly need to be always right.  But I don't need a statistics dweeb trying to preach to me about rigor either.

There's a wonderful mystery series by a Brit writer by the name of Jasper Fforde.  One of the characters is named Jack Schitt.   I make this introduction because I don't think you know him.


by InigoMontoya on Thu Jun 12, 2008 at 12:49:11 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

Btw, see also, the map is not the territory.  Constructs are fine, to a point and to a purpose.  They aren't definitive.


by InigoMontoya on Thu Jun 12, 2008 at 12:57:04 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (2.00 / 1)

so in other words you want it both ways?

Tell you what I'm done talking to you, you are arrogant egotisical and acting like an asshole right now and frankly you've exhausted my patience to play nicely.

You've addressed none of my points and only managed to drag the discussion off topic.

Go ahead and have the last word as I'm sure you must.


-7.33, -3.35 The song that best describes life
by drache on Thu Jun 12, 2008 at 01:39:04 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Good overview (2.00 / 2)

I have a few disagreements but in general it is done well.

I think MI is more a toss up leaning to Obama than in McCain's camp.

Oh and MN won't be a toss up, I am on the ground here and know the state well, there will be a 2% margin for Obama if McCain picks T-Paw (our idiotic governor), 6% if he doesn't.

Recced for an honest look at the race.


Student Guy=JoeMentum. No really Student Guy=JoeMentum, after all JoeMentum was an embarrassment so is Student Guy. This sig is FAIL!!
by Student Guy on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 09:48:04 PM EST

im kind of against a unity ticket now. (none / 0)

but you do make a good point about HRC and the poll testing.


"Me Fail English? That's Unpossible." Ralph Wiggum
by canadian gal on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 09:51:01 PM EST

Can I ask why? (2.00 / 1)

Preference to see Senator Clinton able to exert her influence somewhere else, like staying in the Senate?


Proud member of the Wikipedia Generation of American politics
by BishopRook on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 09:54:57 PM EST
[ Parent ]

well... (none / 0)

for a few reasons  -like the one you mentioned, the fact that i think she would inadvertently (by nature of her being her) at times be too much of a rock star vp to the detriment of the president, and the fact that i think it may beneath her abilities to be frank.

on the other hand, as the diarist notes, she serves to bring in/compliment key demographics needed to win, she's poll tested, and awesome.

so.... either way i guess.


"Me Fail English? That's Unpossible." Ralph Wiggum
by canadian gal on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:11:16 PM EST
[ Parent ]

oh... (none / 0)

another plus is she would make history as the first female in the history of the US to serve in the highest office.


"Me Fail English? That's Unpossible." Ralph Wiggum
by canadian gal on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:19:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

6) For all that the liberal/Left blogosphere is consumed by the question of Hillary supporters voting for Obama, there is a lot of lack of enthusiasm for McCain in many parts of the Republican party. Note: I'll wager right now that evangelical vote for McCain is significantly lower than for Bush.

I'll do you one better.  I predict Obama, with the help of his Joshua Generation Project, wins more Evangelical voters than McCain.

You may say that I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one.


Proud member of the Wikipedia Generation of American politics
by BishopRook on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 09:53:39 PM EST

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (2.00 / 1)

Not a dreamer but part of the Obama echosphere.  I'll make book on that one right now.   Obama makes inroad on the evangelical vote but no way does he carry it.


by InigoMontoya on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 09:56:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

I'll qualify my previous statement--it all depends on who McCain chooses as his running mate.  If he chooses Mike Huckabee or someone else with strong evangelical and/or social-conservative credentials, then he may be able to motivate older evangelicals to come out and vote for him.

If he doesn't do that, though, they stay home and the younger evangelicals will come out and vote strongly for Obama.  I intend to make sure of that, I'll be doing lots of voter registration drives over the next several months. :P

It's really not that unheard-of for evangelicals to vote for Democrats; 1976 wasn't that long ago, and we haven't had a Democratic nominee who wears his Christian faith on his sleeve as much as Obama does since Carter.


Proud member of the Wikipedia Generation of American politics
by BishopRook on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:12:38 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

Not a dreamer but part of the Obama echosphere.

your need to insult people who disagree with you doesn't do a whole lot to bolster your credibility


by BlueinColorado on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 11:23:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

Bush's approval rating is at a new low

I feel like I've been hearing this for years. If it was really a new low every time, wouldn't he be polling at like -100 at this point?:D


by animated on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 09:55:22 PM EST

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

Bush's approval has been ratcheting downward for years.   There was a long period where it would duck into the mid-30's and then rebound to 40.  Republicans today would be ecstatic for Bush to have a 40 rating.  It's been in the low 30's, high 20's for some time now.   New low is for Rasmussen; I think Gallup has it at 28...differences in methodology, etc., which I don't think are as important as the overall picture.  Bush is at or near a new absolute low in all the polling, take your pick.


by InigoMontoya on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 09:59:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

My former governor, Bob Taft, polled as low as 6% towards the end.

Yes, you read that right.


by Reaper0Bot0 on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:51:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (2.00 / 1)

you're state by state is incomplete

You neglect that McCain (having trouble with the Evangalicals and losing votes to Barr) has to seriously worry about bleeding in the south.

That even though Obama took his name off in Michigan that it's a blue state and (most likely) won't forget what McCain told the state in the GOP primairy about it's industry.

Thus at worst it's a toss up there.

And Minnosata? You have got to be kidding me, I'd agree a little if you had rated it a toss up but it in no way leans for McCain.

FL is not out of reach, you're too quick to dismiss the advantages Obama has there. Sure Clinton would have had more advantages, but even then it would STILL be leaning GOP.

OH again the same tired thing of 'but Obama didn't win it' the primairy results are not a guideto the GE not really. Obama didn't win CA or NY but he's going to in teh GE.

Mostly though it's okay if Obama doesn't win OH as there's other states he can take; McCain on the other hand has to win OH or go home.

Oh and stop the insults, while Mississippi is indeed a long shot NC isn't it's at least a toss up; due to demographics, grass roots and other factors. Same with Virgiana


-7.33, -3.35 The song that best describes life
by drache on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:00:00 PM EST

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

I did rate Minnesota a Democratic toss-up that would be a Democratic hold, with Obama doing better than Kerry.

No way is Obama taking NC.  You heard it here first.  I know the echosphere may differ.

The state where I could be wrong is Michigan.  I'm looking at voting history, current environment, and my own in-state resources.   Some of you may forget just how redneck large parts of Michigan are.  And don't underestimate a drag due to Granholm.


by InigoMontoya on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:03:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

I do apologize about Minnossata, I was scrolling up and down for that analysis and misread teh catorgry you put it in.

No way on NC eh? You don't even think it will be close?

Based on what? The math, statistics and logic say you're wrong that at the very least Obama can make a contest out of it and force McCain to defend it.

And echosphere? Perhaps you need to brush up on your math skills because the analysis on NC (done rather impartially) has nothing to do with how much or little people want Obama to win.

You know just because you don't like what you're hearing doesn't make it okay to throw out ad hominems, it's childish frankly

Michigan is not going to McCain, the AA vote and turn out alone is going to give Obama a huge head start. For MI to be in play obama would have to lose every group but AA by something like 40 points and that's just not realistic.


-7.33, -3.35 The song that best describes life
by drache on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:09:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

The echosphere?  I actually agree Obama doesn't take NC... its trending purple, but it will take another 4-8 years... Its like Colorado was in 2000.  

However, NC is going to be closer than you think.  I bet McCain by 5%.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:20:42 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

I think it's agreed that NC is a stretch but given lack of enthusiam on the GOP's part, a record AA and youth vote and even Obama denting the Evanglicals (all assumptions but given the last 5 months not unreasonable) I think Obama could turn NC faster.


-7.33, -3.35 The song that best describes life
by drache on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:30:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Great Read! (none / 0)

A unity ticket seems more and more like the best option. If BO could elevate his 51% support among women(which HRC as VP would do), the presidency is his.


by Chelsea in 2020 on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:00:16 PM EST

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (2.00 / 1)

I'm going to say with a certain amount of trepidation that I think NH swings Obama.

Here's my reasoning - total Democratic Primary vote larger than Republican Primary vote. Next, remember this is basically an open primary. You just declare on day of primary. So Independents can vote and they swung Democratic in the primary. 2006 the state went bluer and I think the trend will continue.

Also over looked -the significant libertarian movement here which hurts McCain.


Faced with the choice between changing one's mind and proving that there is no need to do so, almost everyone gets busy on the proof.
by jsfox on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:17:10 PM EST

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

Um the Demos of North Carolina are MUCH different than Mississippi.  North Carolina is closer to Virginia than Mississippi.  I'd say a better statement would be Georgia and mississippi.

Obama will win Michigan.  McCain has been close in EVERY poll.  Given Obama has NEVER campaigned there, while McCain HAS campaigned there often... and the BEST McCain is doing is a 4 point victory to a 3 point loss... That indicates trouble for him.  You forgot about that in your analysis.

As for New Hampshire... Ultimately, I think it goes for Obama in a close one... Obama will be able to out spend him, while McCain has to protect states.

You seem to forget that PA was close in 2000 and 2004.  Its a swing state... we were probably going to have to spend resources anyway.

Ohio will depend on a few things... but you seem to erroneously compare CLinton to McCain.  Just because Clinton is more popular in a state than Obama, doesn't mean McCain is.  Ohio will be uber close... if the nation polls show 3-4% or higher PV win, Obama takes Ohio.


http://www.imvotingrepublican.com/ McCain Sucks!
by yitbos96bb on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:18:52 PM EST

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

You forgot something in the 'Obama plus' column. In spite of MUCH concern, Hispanics have moved definitively into the Obama column.

There is absolutely NO telling how Obama is going to ultimately do in either Michigan or Florida at this point. He hasn't really hit either state hard yet. I doubt his numbers will go anywhere but up.  

There is no way Wisconsin or Minnesota are even close. McCain's getting buried in both.

Something I don't think ANY of us are really prepared for is the effect of the enormous democratic GOTV of this election. Both Clinton and Obama drove turnout to record levels, and Obama's STILL organizing voter registration drives. There is no poll that can even get close to knowing what effect this will have, because the scope is unprecedented in modern politics. Combine this with the fact that people aren't all that jazzed up about McCain, and some truly crazy states could end up going for Obama.


by EvilAsh on Wed Jun 11, 2008 at 10:33:19 PM EST

Bob Barr may help Obama in Nevada (none / 0)

Harry Reid survived his Senate race in 1998 only because a Libertarian candidate took 2 percent of the vote.

Ron Paul did better than McCain in the Nevada GOP primary (or did they have caucuses?).

Anyway, I think that gives Obama a fighting chance at Nevada this November.

I share your concerns regarding MI and OH, and I agree that FL is out of reach for Obama.


John McCain: 100 years in Iraq "would be fine with me."
by desmoinesdem on Thu Jun 12, 2008 at 12:04:25 AM EST

Re: Bob Barr may help Obama in Nevada (none / 0)

I'm curious could you explain why FL is out of reach for Obama?

To be clear I'm of the opnion that Florida currently in the best senario is a pure toss up and at worst is lean GOP. I base this on the registered Dems out numbering the registered GOP, the fact that the old gaurd of Cubans are now out numbered by younger Cubans (who go for Obama hands down) the fact that the very popular Gov is republican and probably handed Fl to McCain during the primairy and that Obama has yet to campaign there.


-7.33, -3.35 The song that best describes life
by drache on Thu Jun 12, 2008 at 12:16:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

No one has mentioned Missouri.  


by IncognitoErgoSum on Thu Jun 12, 2008 at 12:24:36 AM EST

Re: Is Obama's glass 7/8 full or 1/2 empty? (none / 0)

As a Missourian, I can tell you that as always it's going to depend on who turn outs and where.

It always really has and given that I'd say that Obama then has the edge because they know how to turn out voters as opposed to the McCain campaign that seem to believe it will either happen or won't happen but there's nothing they can do to change things


-7.33, -3.35 The song that best describes life
by drache on Thu Jun 12, 2008 at 01:41:17 AM EST
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